As the U.S.–China trade war deepens, James Check reveals how debt and volatility are colliding, while Bitcoin quietly stands out as the signal in the storm.
We are living through a profound transformation in global finance, and this episode captures it through the lens of escalating U.S.-China tensions, financial market instability, and a broader systemic unraveling driven by debt and outdated monetary frameworks. James Check outlines how Trump’s tariffs have triggered a chain reaction—from hedge funds unwinding leveraged trades to a spike in Treasury yields—while traditional safe havens like bonds falter. With the MOVE index signaling levels of stress unseen since 2008, and China potentially stepping back from U.S. debt markets, the system’s foundation appears increasingly unstable. In this chaos, Bitcoin and gold emerge as neutral reserve assets, with Bitcoin notably outperforming equities since early 2024. The conversation extends into the philosophical, suggesting we may be in the midst of a “fourth turning,” with the U.S. dollar’s reserve status turning from asset to liability. Ideas like a “Bitbond” and a dual currency system—Bitcoin for savings, fiat for spending—hint at a market-driven path forward, where sound money reclaims its role as the bedrock of stability.
This episode delivers both a sobering warning and a hopeful roadmap, framing the trade war as part of a larger collapse of the fiat, debt-based system. James Check exposes the deep cracks in global finance but points to Bitcoin and sound money as a path toward stability. Rather than succumb to fear, listeners are urged to reclaim financial sovereignty, build resilient communities, and recognize this volatile moment as a rare opportunity to lay the foundation for a more sustainable future.
0:00 - Intro
0:34 - Tariff bomb
6:30 - Recession incoming
9:28 - Fold & Bitkey
11:10 - Yen/dollar devaluation game of chicken
15:35 - Gold and Bitcoin’s price floor
25:04 - Unchained Event
25:29 - Bull case is more likely
34:18 - Thesis meeting reality
43:53 - Bitcoinization of finance
47:01 - Bessent reset
54:29 - Closing monologue
(00:00) the odds of recession are much higher now how as a business can you make decisions in this kind of environment you don't know what the tariffs are in the next six hours let alone what they're going to be in six months you've got US and China which are two apex economic predators going at each other so there's a game of chicken there neither President Trump or President Xi are the type to back down and then you got the Treasury and the Fed which one of those is going to blink first kind of watching the moment when World War I
(00:24) started to go from small spot fires around the world to like a mass configuration no countdown James no I got it thank you for joining us what did you just say we're living through man we're living through living through history man how do you want to describe it everything is happening we're living through something very very big right the world is changing in front of us is it happening is it is the the big one that everybody's been talking about finally happening oh man well this is the thing so something I've been certainly
(00:59) grappling with uh and I've been trying to like process what is going on at the moment because it's obvious it's massive and some of the kind of talking points I've got is uh there's no undo button this feels like a freezing Russia reserves type thing where the tariffs have come in it's very like what do we got 17% or something is the current number on the US onto China china's 84% back we've started something now that there's no undo button for um and the other thing I'm playing around with is you know as Bitcoiners we've all we've
(01:32) thought about this stuff we've contemplated what it looks like when the system starts to change we've studied it we've listened to podcast we've you know listen to what experts have to say it's one thing to learn about it it's another thing to start seeing it unfold and actually running through the mental loops of what does this actually look like to live through this event and I think that's where we're at at the moment we're starting to see some early signs and in many ways like the memes are out there but eventually people are
(01:58) going to realize that like there's a lot of really Oh no lost them [ __ ] there you are lost everything start again no you're uh your internet is like in and out i lost you a couple times there before you ultimately dropped off they're telling Bedford so you can blame Pete McCormack for that yeah Bedford it looks like they need a new Merida to lay down some fiber optic cables well it was funny actually i was in I was in Dubai on the way here and I had to stop off and uh run some calcs on my my website and the internet was running
(02:34) I think it was like I did the couch was like 20 times faster than my home internet in uh in Australia so the Dubai airport is 20 times better than my home internet it's uh you'd think it's 2025 we should have Dubai level internet everywhere you'd think so i mean we spent an absolute for it's a classic example of a government program right they built all this um internet infrastructure and they they fluff it all at the end and uh now it it flags out all the time yeah um but getting back to it the tariff wars are in place it seems
(03:12) like many people are saying World War II has started but it seems like some sort of cold economic war has certainly started and I wrote about this in my newsletter last night which was posted this morning i think it's particularly interesting in the last 12 hours because you're you're beginning to see the domino effect hit and and Zero Hedge wrote this great piece last night highlighting something that they've been warning about for the better part of two years which is this basis trade that a lot of the multistrap hedge funds have
(03:47) been putting on for for years now and that seems to be getting off size or 20x levered I believe on close to $2 trillion in value and you have Trump throw this tariff bomb at the world uh yields start getting a little wonky and then eventually that basis trade those hedge funds get off sides and they're forced liquidators of of these treasury assets the tents and the 30s specifically and so we have spreads blowing out these yields blowing out and yeah it seems like it could be could be the big one i I would not want to be
(04:24) drone pal this morning that's for sure no and I've been thinking about like a game of chicken you've got Trump and CH or US and China and which are two apex economic predators going at each other so there's a game of chicken there one's the data one's the creditor one produces everything one consumes everything which one backs down first neither neither President Trump or President Xi are the type to to back down so you've got one game of chicken played out there you've got another game of chicken between I would say Congress
(04:53) and Trump because at some point in time if things continue to get hairy we know that the US is a hyper financialized economy equities come down too much it's going to start impacting employment right and just the tariffs how do businesses make economic decisions if you've been import you know if a key part of your business chain or supply chain is importing from China which many will be suddenly you you don't know what your fulfillment prices are going to be how much you going to have to pay is it going to eat your profit margin what if
(05:19) you've got contracts that are already set up so that's going to start to hit some kind of an employment wall I would say and then when you get to that stage it's like well does Congress try to take away the keys from from Trump so you've got cuz you know they need to get reelected in the midterms no one wants to go through that in a stagflationary or highly inflationary or a depression so suddenly there's a there's a tension there and then you got the Treasury and the Fed which one of those is going to blink first right so it's it's it's
(05:45) hairy stuff um and you mentioned you know credit spreads and like I'm writing a a piece at the moment the move index right which is the uh when I was talking to Nick Baria that's the number one metric he's he's modeled all sorts of liquidity um he's built his own liquidity um metrics and and indexes from uh from the ground up and he was saying that the move index volatility in treasuries is the number one thing that's the number one factor that he looks at and it's currently getting to levels it's above March 2020 so it's
(06:12) above the the co peak um and we're up in 2008 and 2023 which is you know are we starting to get to like a bit of a a Liz trust moment in the uh in the bond market especially if they start going after tax cuts next it's starting to look a little bit like the guilt market back in uh 22 yeah and I I was responding to somebody on X this morning they were like "How how do you get this under control?" It's like you can't control Frankenstein and I think that's really what is being brought to light today is that Trump and Bent I think the way in which
(06:49) they Trump I don't know if Pent had the hand in how terrorists were presented to the world with the uh with the calculation that they did and didn't seem to be exactly reciprocal out of the gate was a bit of a wild card but even if they were to do it correctly I I think everybody in the analyst world the macro cognizenti the pundits and even the policy makers really underestimate just how fragile the system is and any little deviant uh deviation from uh just making sure that the debt is taken care of will create these externalities that lead to
(07:32) these cascading events which is certainly what we're seeing now 100% and and that's where I call it this game of chicken like at some point in time and I often talk about like the gravity of the situation and then the managed response if you allow the system to just do its thing yields go higher right because why would you lend to a government it doesn't make any sense so yields want to go higher so they have to at some point at some point it's going to get bad enough whether it's because equities come down enough unemployment goes up
(07:58) enough recession like and I think we should all be very careful here the odds of recession are much higher now much much higher because how can how as a business can you make decisions in this kind of environment you can't because you don't know what the tariffs are in the next 6 hours let alone what they're going to be in 6 months how do you plan your orders how do you plan your margin how do you plan your staffing it's a real tricky scenario so if we get to that type of scenario who blinks first cuz at at some point in time you need to
(08:27) find buyers for the bonds and you mentioned the carry trade if I understand correctly you know you look at where the biggest owners of treasuries are and is it Cayman Islands is number one by some margin it's all these you know offshore hedge funds running this trade and as we know with hedge funds they're flaky ass once you start once anything is not profitable for them they're out once volatility gets too much and their risk management taps on the shoulder they sell they sell first ask questions later so if that's
(08:56) your marginal buyer China's I mean I can't imagine China's going to be buying too many treasuries at this point in time if anything they they would start to lean on it and actually sell them if they really want to pressure um pressure pressure Trump on the other side we are watching two apex economic predators going at each other and unfortunately the stability of the system is kind of the pawn in the in the game of chess so it's a it's a really tricky scenario and I think everyone should be just really really careful and cognizant that it's
(09:22) it's hairy out there right it'll resolve itself but it's not going to happen in weeks this is a This is a long-term process sup freaks do you have a credit card are you getting cash back or airline points or points for some other service guess what those are [ __ ] coins you want to be stacking Bitcoin and I have some groundbreaking news for you the team at Fold has finally released the Bitcoin Rewards credit card they have a wait list going to be distributing the cards later this year so you want to get on the wait list full
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(10:26) into a two or three multic you have one key on the hardware wallet one key on your mobile device and block stores a key in the cloud for you this is an incredible hardware device for your friends and family or maybe yourself who have Bitcoin on exchanges and have for a long time but haven't taken the step to self- custody because they're worried about the complications of setting up a private public key pair securing that seed phrase setting up a PIN setting up a passphrase again Bit Key makes it easy to use hard to lose it's the easiest
(10:55) zero to one step your first step to self-custody if you have friends and family on the exchanges who haven't moved it off tell them to pick up a big key go to bitkey.world use the key TFTC20 at checkout for 20% off your order that's bit.world code TFTC20 that's another part of it too cuz that yesterday during the day everybody's like China's definitely dumping treasuries um yields are going back up and then after markets closed it became apparent like nobody's dumping treasuries like like if they were yields wouldn't be
(11:26) screaming this high if it was China doing like a controlled selling of their their US 10 years and 30 years like something's obviously gone wrong and so that's I think that's the question in my mind right now like is there a temporary clearing sort of environment that we go through where these hedge funds have to get out of this basis trade things settle down and then China Japan Europe get the US get to the negotiation table and figure out all right let's just rip the band-aid off figure out how we reset the uh the chessboard here and make sure
(12:03) that we don't blow up the global financial system uh or is like the Trump administration thinking like all right I mean Bent came out this morning and said this is um something along the lines of hedge funds are overexposed and what we're watching is just a clearing mechanism of those positions getting offside like is descent thinking like we can cuz I I would like to get your thoughts on this like do you think their mindset is it looks like China's being forced to devalue the yuan rapidly and to levels of which they were they were holding
(12:43) previously and is there sort of like a game of chicken where it's like they just need we just need them to devalue the the yuan to such a point where they're forced to come to the table and negotiate and terms that are preferable to us i mean and this is I think that to be honest I don't even have the macro chops to properly understand all these dynamics and that's what I think is for me as a student of markets this is just a point where I'm like wow I'm just absorbing what's going on and trying to get my head around it um there's the
(13:12) devaluation side but we also know that if the US wants to be competitive they actually need the yarn to strengthen because they need the dollar to be weaker right so when I look at this whole dynamic the US obviously wants to onshore they're trying to move from a Wall Street dominated economy to a main street dominated economy and that means bring manufacturing production and that's a national security thing as well so you got to bring all these production back on shore but the thing that keeps I keep coming back to is the sequence of
(13:40) events luke Roman talks about this the sequence of events you have to devalue the dollar before you do all this stuff and the way I'm looking at it it's all great to have this tariff policy and again I'm I'm not how do I know what order these things should be in but when I look at it you don't have the production capacity and if you want to build the production capacity in the US or in neighboring allies you need to probably buy the equipment the parts the components from China in order to build it in the first place and also that you
(14:10) don't just pop a factory out of nowhere uh that's going to take time it's going to be expensive there's going to be investment involved there's just a lot of moving parts that to me it feels like they've gone I mean I get it they've gone in to try and create maximum leverage and I think something else I find challenging is you can't trust anything out of out of China right do you know are they in a depression that there's a lot of commentators who say that China's on their knees and you look at other people and say well the US is
(14:36) kind of not doing so well either right on a relative scale and where are these two what are the real tipping points we're going to have to find out but you know bond markets are going to tell a story um equity markets tell a story what's going on in the currencies i also think if you look at commodities commodities have been absolutely slammed uh the Australian dollar lost 5% in one day just straight down because we saw that all commodities went down we're obviously a commodity-driven nation we don't export anything except commodities
(15:04) and uh when you see that that means I mean China is the biggest buyer of commodities so if you think about it from like the Dr copper perspective if all these commodities are saying something ain't right it's probably something ain't right in in China's backyard rather than elsewhere so I think that's just one of those dynamics to pay attention to it tells you China's probably not in the best position maybe that's why they're doing the tariffs so hard and fast up front but at the same time someone's someone's going to have
(15:30) to back down whether it's the Fed whether it's China whether it's Trump man tricky stuff very tricky stuff and I think the the way I'm what I'm anchoring to is you can try to point out one thing or another whether it's tariffs on China the back and forth sort of tariff war that's going on right now the basis trade and the hedge funds going offside Europe in a weak position whatever you want to point at you can you can try to say it's this that or the other it's probably in reality a combination of all those things and that's just swinging up
(16:09) branches where the core of the problem is the money like we're in this situation because we live in this debtfueled global financial system and this is ultimately what was going to happen eventually maybe not this exact situation was uh predicted by people but I think you can just distill everything to there's too much debt not enough dollars to service that debt and regardless of what ultimately the catalyst was for pushing markets to the brink where they are right now um the underlying problem is this debt issue and we we need to figure
(16:46) out how to reorient the global economy around better money and get away from fiat and I think and there's a case to be made that um No I agree and you know when you think about it what else do you hold at this point in time like imagine Bitcoin didn't exist what else would you hold i mean it gold is the only answer at this point in time you're just like hands off i can't own equities can't own bonds i can't own commodities what do you own you just gold hand off just see what happens right because it is that neutral
(17:16) res it's the shelling point it's the ultimate shelling point i'm just going to buy something that is going to be there on the other side of that now we obviously live in a world where we've got Bitcoin as well and whilst it's you know if you look at the general performance um the equity market both NASDAQ and S&P they have more or less given back 100% of their gain since the start of 2024 bitcoin hasn't quite given back as much on a relative basis right we've started the year at uh 42K back in 2024 we're trading at 78 so yes Bitcoin is down 32%
(17:48) off its all-time high but it's still doing much better since 2024 relative to equities equities have given everything back and you know again I'm not saying that there's some kind of decoupling going on i think that's a little bit overblown here and there but at the same time if we take just a a really big honest snapshot from the 1st of January 2024 gold is kicking ass basically at alltime highs right barely come off its peak um up 3% today as well equities have given back pretty much everything up 2% in the last whatever it is 15
(18:17) months or so and uh Bitcoin's up you know almost 2x for round numbers 40k 80k it's up 2x so that kind of gives you a bit of a ballpark that bitcoin is somewhere in between gold and and and uh and equities on a relative basis just just by that very crude simple metric but that kind of shows you the the lay of the land right there is and even though Bitcoin is down there's a lot I mean man the sentiment on Twitter is just destroyed um it's been quite very interesting actually watching sentiment on Twitter i find it a very interesting
(18:49) gauge a lot of people feel like they were cheated this cycle they didn't get the returns that they wanted so on so forth and I just look at you know the stats I just mentioned even with this correction from alltime high Bitcoin's up 2x since 2024 just that simple dynamic it's like people are missing the forest through the trees sound money is doing a whole lot better than pretty much anything else you would buy and relatively speaking I mean Nvidia has come off quite a bit i haven't checked the numbers recently but Nvidia has been
(19:15) the only asset that has outperformed Bitcoin over any meaningful time frame and I would say if we were to run the numbers over some you know recent history I would say Nvidia is giving back a hell of a lot more than than Bitcoin is on a relative basis yeah and that that begs the question what are what are you seeing on chain your newsletter it's been this week's been a whirlwind i can't remember if this is a newsletter you wrote over the weekend last week last week or earlier this week but basically I think it was
(19:44) called Monday night top of the chop it's Wednesday top of the chop uh we're back in the 70s and in that newsletter and the video you produced love what you're putting out by the way it really helps settle me i say this every time you come on but um I was using sort of what you were seeing on chain to sort of gauge like all right how how low could we potentially go and who knows this could be a rest bit bitcoin's up a bit this morning um but what what are you seeing what do you think Bitcoin does moving forward based
(20:21) off of of what's happening looks like we touched mid70s we're floating back up you know I think on Monday you said there's potential that we could go back to the 60s but you believe that trillion dollar market cap is sort of a a floor that showed really strong support last year and is likely the support level if we head that direction moving forward yeah and and I I view markets as a confidence game right and uh I think the quote that I used in that piece was in a sea of sand a single flag becomes a target um I was just talking to Alex
(20:53) Thornne about this concept you know in uh what is it must be Return of the Jedi when uh C-3PO and R2-D2 get launched down and they start on Tatooine they're in the sand and then they see that little thing poke up and they start walking towards it because it's the only I think C3PO walks towards it because it's the only obvious thing to walk towards so now think about that in the context of markets we're out there in this sea of sand you can't see anything it's a shelling point suddenly you see something that is crystal clear like oh
(21:19) I know that there was demand for eight months between 70 and 50k that chop consolidation range the market has a a pretty decent idea that there's confidence people bought there it's likely if we go back there people are probably going to see demand again so to me it made sense that's why the air pocket was just a really obvious thing for the market to want to go to find out how much demand is down there if you liked Bitcoin at 100 you liked it at 90 how do you like it at 75 prove that you actually want to bid this
(21:48) thing higher so to me it's it's one of those just like natural gravity things that the market wants to test now if we were to keep going lower and and in that post I tried to identify that like across a whole bunch of different metrics MVRV may multiple all sorts of cyclical oscillators this cycle is very different to previous cycles every cycle has its own resonance and when I say cycle actually I'm not talking about your 4year h havinging cycle the more I look at the data and the more I start to just like piece together where things
(22:19) transitioned and changed the first cycle in my opinion was a very retail driven adoption cycle ended at the 2017 peak everything had a different characteristic back then the failures from 2018 till FTX blew up in 2022 also had its own unique characteristics lots of booms lots of bust we had the 2019 straight up bare market 2021 straight up bare market lots of vertical up and down you can see it in the oscillators big divergences large amplitude big up big down 2023 onwards much more structured an institutional type cycle has its own
(22:58) frequency has its own amplitude it's smaller amplitude but it's far more stable we're down 30% and people are as bearish as I've ever seen them it's a really interesting dynamic so within that context the 75 zone top of the chop it is an area where you want the bulls to mount a defense this is about as bad as it's been in any there's been two previous corrections the yen carry trade and kind of the late stage chop consolidation and there was another one in August September 2023 and all of those had about the same amount of
(23:27) damage lots of fear lots of realized loss lots of investor response that was saying this looks like a capitulation point you want to see the bulls actually mount a defense here so if they don't the next step is we go back down to the chop consolidation range and we find out how deep into that we go and the sea the flag in the sea of sand for me down there 65k is a model that I call the true market mean uh it's basically the average cost basis for active investors so if we get down there you can roughly say that the average Bitcoiner is
(23:59) probably really really sensitive or if you've been around for 5 years you're probably underwater on your position you're not enjoying it you're not having a fun time anymore so 65K is a really sensitive point 67 is where my um uh strategies cost basis is i don't think it's going to liquidate strategy i don't have any concerns about the business model strategy but you can imagine the headlines imagine the Bitcoin obituaries that are going to be flashing across the screen imagine the Bloomberg terminal every Tradfire guy in the world is going
(24:27) to be adding an obituary to that chart that's a level where it's if you want to have a full scale capitulation probably going to happen somewhere in there i struggle to see the market going down to 40K that's kind of the next major stop because then you're undoing the ETFs and you're undoing a trillion dollar market cap can it happen of course do I expect it to happen it's not my base case it could happen in a flash event if we go into some kind of really nasty recession anything is possible but I think yeah 65
(24:57) that's that's just a level where the the damage would be so bad i I can see it starting to form um you know we'll see if we get there or not the new administration is pushing hard for government efficiency but can Elon Musk and Doge fix the dollar on April 16th PhD economist Peter Stain explains why Bitcoin is the most important tool for government efficiency and how the principles underlying the global shift towards sound money can help you protect and grow your generational wealth register now at unchained.com/r that's
(25:30) unchained.comr yeah I'll be the resident bully here i find it hard to believe that we're going to get there going back to your flag in in the sea of sand because you have to this basis trade is truly blowing blowing up i mean that was the really interesting part of the zero hedge piece from last night that reminded me like people forget the repo spasm of 2019 September 2019 uh the Fed literally created new facilities for these hedge funds to tap into the Fed window to get liquidity to make sure that they were onside so that they
(26:04) didn't incite this long-term capital management like blow up um that that had rippling effects throughout the financial system and I guess that's the big question and what Zero Hedge po posed in their their um piece last night is like drone pals it's like literally the the man over the two buttons meme like do I let the hedge funds fail or do I bail them out but by doing so essentially let the market think that I'm bailing out Trump and his his tariff policy and sort of uh bending the knee to what he's been beating the drum for the last year which
(26:44) is lower rates lower rates lower rates and it's just just very interesting predicament I find it hard to believe that I mean just the history of my life past performance is not indicative of future results and past actions are not indicative of future actions but every pattern recognition alarm bell of liquidity crisis fed step in is going off in my brain like I find it hard to fathom that they're not going to step and and bail this out with lower rates and probably they probably won't call it QE but QE by another name and if that's
(27:21) the case uh it'll be interesting to see if the long end of the yield curve reacts like it did last September when they began lowering rates and went inverse to what people would have expected and if that happens then it's all bets are off it's like you can't trust treasuries there's no faith in this this credit system and in the US dollar system as we've known it like we need to find safety in assets that are completely detached from this which Bitcoin I think will be very very clear that it is one of these assets that is
(27:56) completely separate from this debtfueled system yep no and I think that's that's relevant like if you think about just tariffs at the simplest thing if you're a company suddenly your import costs have gone up you're going to have to reshore supply chains you got to rethink about this stuff bitcoin doesn't have to worry about any of that it literally doesn't have CEO risk it doesn't have company risk it doesn't have import risk it doesn't have employee risk the whole point of it is that it doesn't have any of these things so gold and Bitcoin are
(28:22) clear examples there there's another crazy world where you can say "Well Apple's probably going to pay back its debt even if the US government's going to struggle to or print the money to do so." So in a way people might pile in back into equities just because they're a better option than and I I put out a tweet it was a bit provocative but um the tweet was US equals em because in many ways the US is trading a little bit like an emerging market right where in the times of stress and distress people sell the bonds they don't want to keep
(28:52) their money in the debt because they know that the debasement has to come in and they're not going to get paid back in real terms and it's very interesting because I know that as Bitcoiners we spent a lot of time thinking about this um I also know that just based on you know you and me our age there's a lot of people who've never experienced right properly when you're in your adult life and you've properly thought about and understood markets i only got into markets in 2017 and even then there's a learning process from here to there and
(29:18) whilst I've spent a lot of time doing it i'm not going to pretend to say that I've got experience trading a 1970s inflationary crisis right of course I don't so there's a lot of us who we've thought a lot about this but then to see it play out and to take all the new information in and see if it actually hits your thesis does it change anything does your way of thinking have to shift and I think it will um we're all going to have to rethink our um our approach and how we think about these markets but there's also a lot of things I agree
(29:46) with you in full that the alarm bells are ringing i remember I think it was Christmas 2018 i was living in London at the time and I remember the power pivot market started selling off um there's a really nasty Christmas and then suddenly assets start going higher again repo rate spasm in 2019 same thing uh CO uh I think CO is almost a relevant example here because if you've got all these tariffs um some companies they're not going to be able to get you know you can't drive a car or build a finished car if you're missing one chip one
(30:16) computer chip that just stops the car from working completely whole supply chain's wrecked so there's going to be some component somewhere in the mix that can't be found at some point in time because of these tariffs and as a result there's going to be shortages of things there going to be a slowdown in certain industries there's going to be things that you didn't expect just aren't available and aren't there so all of these dynamics I mean it's going to be so variable and so dynamic i think people should be really cautious but at the
(30:44) same time um you know for me what do I what do you do bitcoin and gold and just wait right have enough cash so if something goes really wrong you're not going to get yourself in hot water cuz the most important thing be solvent you do not want to get yourself into a position where you got to start selling your Bitcoin at a distressed price because you got to pay bills that's the worst possible thing so make sure that you you've got enough to get through some storm in the near term because I think that's that should be your base
(31:11) case but I agree with you you look at the alarm bells you say no political party wants to go into the midterms or any election in a in a deflationary bust they don't want to go into in a recession they don't want to go into into a stagflationary environment they're going to have to deal with all these things right all these variables but you know there's all these different tension um around the system um and we're just waiting to see which one cracks and breaks first yeah it makes me I was wondering there was people tweeting about it last
(31:42) night went to bed thinking about it woke up thinking about it uh if the the bond yield situation gets out of hand and say the Fed steps in their lower interest rates QE by another name does nothing to prevent yields from continuing to scream higher is the US government forced to think creatively and like do something like a bit bond like hey we're going to put Bitcoin in the 10-year Treasury or at least some of the offering um and attach a lower yield to that just to make sure that we can service it that because that's the other thing the the
(32:20) deficit here in the US it's on on pace to be well over $2 trillion this fiscal year you you have Trump saying we're going to lower taxes obviously this downturn in markets severely going to hinder capital gains taxes that the government's going to take in and that's not going to be good for bond yields and like are they forced the thing created that's the thing like they've got no cap gains now they just wiped out the whole year's worth of gains so that's going to hit receipts uh tax cuts in this environment going for
(32:57) tax cuts that feels to me like the kind of thing where the bond market's going to go "Nah that's it we're done can't own this [ __ ] anymore because where are you going to get the money from how are you going to pay for any of this?" So oh man that's that's another variable right what do tax cuts do um receipts go down if if employment goes down all of these things is just going to make it worse and worse and worse and then you look at it from the perspective of the negotiating table China's aware of this they know that the US is a hyper
(33:25) financialized economy they know that they're going to have all these hits which side starts to bend the knee first i can't I can't see it um and you know again as a student of markets I'm fascinated this like this is the most fascinating I think this is the most fascinating thing that's happened in a very long time um I don't know if they end up doing bit bonds um in a lot of stuff when it comes to Bitcoin reaching that kind of adoption um I I'm I'm happy to be pleasantly surprised i assume that none of that will happen i still assume
(33:56) the government won't buy Bitcoin i'm still in that camp um I will believe it when I see it i still sit there and then I'm always pleasantly surprised when they do something like this but I just like I think they've got so many fish to fry right now and they're real real big suckers it's a uh it's a hairy environment interesting though i mean endlessly fascinating watching two lions go at each other yeah it it's uh are we masochists cuz this is it almost feels bad to I don't want to say getting enjoyment but it's like
(34:28) exhilarating watching this go on we've we've been talking about it for many years like pointing like hey probably should have run a global financial system using all this debt something's going to happen now it's happening and it's I'm not trying to be uh to levy shot shout freight on people and say look I told you so haha uh but it is like fascinating that the Bitcoiners have been right we've all many of us have said like don't know when it's going to happen but just looking at the dynamics and the mechanics of the system
(35:00) as it's laid before me it seems like at some point in the future things are going to hit ahead and it seems like it's happening and not only that I think the the uncertainty that has been introduced by this second Trump administration is to such a degree where that is acting like an accelerant that can really really drive uncertainty to levels that were probably not believable only a year ago no I agree and I I think the I don't think it's masochism i think I think at the end of the day we've done a lot of thinking and it's almost like having
(35:40) read the history book and then watching it and I had one of these experiences recently so I've been I'm traveling in the UK at the moment and on the flight over I finally sat down to read um Steven Mirren who's one of Trump's economic advisers he's got that paper users guide to restructuring the global trade system it's 6 months old now and I'm reading it i'm like man I wish I read this six months ago because it paints the picture of what's going on it's almost like saying "Oh yeah that that happened yesterday." You know
(36:05) they're talking about all these different ideas of how tariffs work how currencies adjust all these dynamics so in many ways I think it's just an appreciation for the scale of what's happening uh you know there's 99% of the world who has no clue right they just say in fact there's another interesting thing in all the hotels and just like as I've passed through public places where there's the news on here in Europe so that's Ireland and the UK every single time without fail doesn't matter what time of day it is Trump tariffs is the
(36:35) thing that's going on on the news it's that is what has been on every single television I've walked past here in the UK so that's an interesting dynamic i think there's also the the scale of Europe sees what's going on and the rest of the world sees what's going on differently to the way America probably sees it um and even then there's going to be divergences of two different Americas right on um on the political spectrum so the whole world is looking at different perspectives different views most people have no clue about the
(37:04) financial plumbing that's going on under the surface it's a very very small pool of people who've really done that work i think a lot of Bitcoiners have done it as like a hobby um you're probably the same as me i understand it what I would say like a cursory view at a hobbyist view i find it fascinating i don't fully understand i'm not going to pretend to fully understand it but I certainly like putting the puzzle pieces together and so far a lot of it is matching up with the thesis a lot of the stuff we've been
(37:30) talking about right as we've all been and that's what I like about the um I know people give [ __ ] to the Bitcoin podcast scene it's a collective learning experience right i've been listening to you and Matt for years um we're just learning about how this [ __ ] works iterating through different ideas talking to different people who do have the experience and overall Bitcoiners have developed this interesting collective psychology just by learning from each other around the world which is a pretty cool concept to itself and
(37:58) now we're seeing it happen or the early signs of the big earthquakes we've seen tremors here and there but now we're seeing the first real shock wave right co was a shock wave um the you know Russia invading Ukraine that was a shock wave this is another shock wave and we're starting to see the frequency increase the magnitudes getting bigger you can and I think what makes this one really fascinating you can reason about the scale of how how good and bad it could get you can see a world where they do in fact come to some kind of trade
(38:30) agreement America does in fact reshore and they do in fact get their production back online you can see that you know golden era environment and It's it's promising i can also just as easily reason a world where it doesn't go so well and things get really really hairy and you can start to just understand the scale of it right it's almost like um uh you're kind of watching the moment when World War I started to just go from small spot fires around the world to like a mass configuration so we're in that kind of environment and I think
(39:01) it's just a recognition it's just a recognition that we can see it we're observing it it's kind of playing into the thesis that alone is scary but you got to be ready your thesis is going to get challenged the Bitcoin thesis is going to get challenged i still think it's going to play out in the end cuz what the hell else do you own but it's uh yeah these are big puzzle pieces moving around the board yeah and building on the Steve Mirren thread I don't know if it was that paper that you finally read on the plane or
(39:30) something he said recently but he's been getting a lot of flack on on Twitter for his comments that the reserve the US dollar as a reserve currency is actually a hindrance to the United States economy cuz he basically explained Triffin's dilemma like over the course of five decades it's hollowed out our manufacturing base and put us in a relatively weak position from a national security perspective and that alone like just acknowledging that Triffin's dilemma exists and in some ways it's incredibly beneficial for the US economy
(40:04) if you believe that being a hyper financialized economy a service-based economy is an extreme privilege that allows us to accumulate a lot of wealth per capita without having to do many hard things outside of creating financial products um can be viewed as a positive has certainly worked in the benefit of the United States for for a period of time but I think we're reaching that sort of cresting point where uh the marginal return the marginal benefit of being this hyper financialized economy is beginning to become a marginal detriment to to the
(40:43) well-being of the country i mean that that alone that signal sent by somebody in the Trump administration that the US dollar is the reserve currency is actually beginning to hurt uh the US economy is a wild totally and and at a national security level that's what's really that's what I find so fascinating about it it is if we don't look after Main Street that's going to become our biggest problem if we don't look after our people that's going to be your biggest problem you got to look after your citizens and it's it
(41:14) is it's a fascinating like you know moving of the overton window but I think that's the other thing all these could you imagine having this conversation 3 months ago 6 months ago no chance the rate of change of very large events is accelerating itself so it's yeah it is it really is wild to live through it and starting to theorize about what happens um beyond here at the end of the day the the Triffin dilemma is ultimately pointing to you can't have a global reserve asset based on one nation because eventually the domestic needs
(41:46) get in the way of the international needs so this why you need the neutral reserve asset it's just that's it's just that simple that that they must be settled in that neutral reserve asset and frankly there's only two examples for that and I've been on on the on board with the idea of a hard money soft money standard like a dual standard i know there's a lot of talk about like oh you know Bitcoin doesn't do the medium of exchange i'm not sure we're going to get to the point of it doing the medium of exchange what I think is going to
(42:12) happen is we're going to have stable coins and there's a there's a few elements to this i think stable coins are just one highly clear piece of evidence that fiat isn't going anywhere anytime soon and that is not because it's not evil it is just because the average person on the street is so far away from understanding Bitcoin and gold and sound money they just how many Bitcoin is I I run this thought experiment all the time just think about your circle of friends how many of them have you managed to orange pill it's a
(42:43) small handful it's not it's not you're lucky if it's 20% so apply that across the whole of society they're just a long way from understanding that fair money is a problem and you've also got governments who don't want to let go of that power so in a way my base case not what I want to happen what I think is going to happen is we're going to have a sound money hard asset savings base bitcoin gold being the national to individual um savings vehicles and then you borrow soft money against it if you've got Bitcoin you borrow soft money
(43:14) against it it actually makes a lot of sense the collateral keeps going up in value the debt gets smaller it's a way to recapitalize the system so in a way fiat almost has to have a second leg of existence where it kind of borrows itself and inflates itself out of the current debt problem because if they don't do that no one wants to go into the depression no one like we can all say we want fiat currency to die no one wants to see it i'm telling you right now it's an awful situation no one wants to see it happen so I think the best
(43:46) possible way is it it almost like it fades away to irrelevance because you've got the hard money standard to bolster it from the background no and this computes with what I've been saying is that we should really be fostering it and a lot of the the individuals who want to go straight to a Bitcoin standard clamor against this but the Bitcoinization of finance is the only way in my mind to manufacture the soft landing that people have been talking about for years just just like you said that the system needs to be
(44:16) recapitalized with better collateral and there is going to be this transitionary period I I would agree where you have this dual currency system where Bitcoin's collateral taking out loans against it into this everinflating fiat just to make sure that the average Joe the common man can go about his life and you can have some semblance of a somewhat functional economy on the way to a Bitcoin standard because if you just rip the band-aid off let everything collapse it's it's going to be much harder to build from there i think a
(44:50) slow and the beauty of it is like the free market can make this happen there's nothing we need from governments to sort of mandate this transition you're just going to see people issuing debt saying you know what if I'm going to give these dollars to you I know that they're being debased and um the equity value of the asset you're trying to to purchase with this debt like I'm I'm not too sure about that to make me more comfortable I want you to either bring some Bitcoin to the table to put as collateral in this
(45:20) loan or we'll take some of the loan proceeds and buy Bitcoin and hold it within the structure so that as a lender I sort of have um I sort of have my downside risk limited because I know that the trust component yes i have assurance that I'm going to get something at the end of it even if things go pear-shaped uh no totally and you know my background is in uh in civil engineering but specifically it's ground engineering and without fail if a building is going to have problems it's almost never the structure it's almost
(45:50) always the foundation because the foundation is what everything else is built on and in the structure you can build whatever you want you can put steel there you can put concrete there you can finetune it we know a lot about those materials in the foundation you get what mother nature gives you so if we bring the I think Preston P has talked about this as well because the foundation of the monetary system uh treasuries when they start having these tremors and these shock waves run through them the whole building above
(46:18) shakes so there's a process of actually replacing that foundation it's not going to be easy it's going to be damn expensive it's going to be super volatile but event if we're putting in gold Bitcoin hard money as that foundational collateral asset and slowly but surely swapping out the treasuries now you can actually remove that triff and dilemma and you're basically delegating that risk to assets that can't fail right bitcoin gold they can't fail they don't have a issuer there's no CEO there's no risk so in that instance
(46:48) there's no triffin dilemma so that you know it's going to be a hairy process and I think it's not going to be weeks it's not going to be months this is a multi-year process it's real for fourth turning [ __ ] which again fascinating yeah no like I've had a few analysts on over the last few months mel Madison um specifically has come on three times in the last four or five months and I think what he what he's put out there beginning of the beginning of December last year was that if the Trump administration hopes to get to midterms
(47:25) and make sure that the Republicans hold the House and the Senate he needs to rip the band-aid off immediately um and let markets correct and figure out what's going to happen from there and then you couple that with what Scott Bent was saying in the leadup to the 2024 election before he was even being flagged as somebody who could be potential secretary of the Treasury was like he he said publicly like I believe there's going to be a Brett and Woods 2.
(47:57) 0 Plaza Accords like monetary order restructuring and I want to be a part of that and a lot can be lost in the fog of war i think it's very safe to say that specifically today we are very much within the fog of war there's people throwing [ __ ] all over the place pointing fingers blaming people but if you look at the US debt situation the need to roll over trillions in treasury debt do you have a license for that internet over there sir testing testing bedford get your [ __ ] together yeah apparent if you watch I know if you watch Netflix you have to
(48:35) have a TV license as well because streaming you crazy are they free in the UK i don't think so um mate I mean thing there's the shades of shades of gray and what is what is free i mean even like Australia is we're going through our own [ __ ] like we've just brought in this new rule goes live next year that uh if you're under 16 you're not allowed to use social media so how are they going to enforce that they're going to force the ID checks of everyone who is not 16 to prove that you are you know an adult which you just look at this thing it's
(49:10) like guys this is really obvious what this is this is not about under 16s on social media this is about controlling who is on the internet who is over 16 it's pretty obvious yeah i mean that's that's another play into this that's the liberty-minded individual in me hopes that all these despotic governments get get uh defunded to a degree where it becomes impossible to implement these types of uh these types of surveillance programs and and other Orwellian ideas but I think I think that's a consequence of the times too
(49:50) these governments are losing control and they need to totally they need to like you like you mentioned earlier the the uh what do you got the Australian dollar fell 5% you have to make sure you ID check people so they're not complaining about inflation the ones that are that's it they'll cut they'll cut your shitty internet off but but yeah I mean like I was listening to um Brent Johnson sorry I was I was listening to Brent Johnson talking to Danny the other day and you know his point was governments you know you may
(50:22) not like it but they're not your friend and uh they are going to bring in and reign in control because they don't want capital to fly they don't want people to escape they they need people to hold the currency as the bag holder that's why they're going to stuff pension funds full of the shitty government bonds so you know they they they don't work in your favor unfortunately yeah now that's another thing that's being floated in all this is capital controls even here the United States you can argue that tariffs are a light form
(50:51) of capital controls where don't send your money outside the country um because it's more expensive to buy those goods start start building them here um but yeah I was uh before we need we need Peter McCormack to become mayor of Bedford so we can get fiber optic cable laid uh in the city so that so that the internet is somewhat somewhat workable but I was talking about descent the leadup to this the need to the many analysts believe that if something was actually going to get done in this administration you were going to
(51:24) hold the house and the senate and essentially be able to see your mandate through uh a whole four-year term we'd need this quick and fast sort of correction let's just get the froth get the waste get the filth out of the system reset and move forward and seems like we're in the fog of war many people are very pissed off right now but if you believe the analysts that are putting this theory out there that this is what they need to do to be able to uh uh to be able to reset things you have a you have a you have a a fall back
(52:00) for a comeback if you will it seems like it could be playing out and I think that talking about fourth turning vibes all of that like I think the probability of people are calling it the Mara Lago accords has gone up significantly in the last 16 hours i think many are severely discounting the potential that ascent trump others really don't care about the long end of the yield curve because they know that it's a lost cause anyway and they just need to sort of force everybody to the table say look this is obviously a problem let's figure out
(52:39) what we got to do maybe we revalue gold um we we rejigger oil contracts internationally we figure out we some of the debt maybe some of it gets relieved i don't know what that's going to look like you mentioned earlier i'm not an expert i'm an observer have had a lot of conversations over the years on these topics and I think that's been one of the common threads is if you look at how treasury markets have been weaponized post Russia Ukraine if you look at how BRICS countries have been posturing for the better part of a decade with their
(53:14) intent to diversify away from the dollar dominated system um it seems like we could be living through sort of the rip the band-aid off make it very obvious that there's a systemic problem with US treasuries being the reserve asset of the global financial system and get everybody that's able to figure it out it's an interesting theory because as you were talking I was contemplating this idea you know how they revalue the gold this whole idea it's an accounting gimmick what if it's not an accounting gimmick and again this is just me kind
(53:47) of contemplating things if they were to revalue the gold bring the whatever it is 85 thousand tons up to um current prices yes they would get the deposit of the trillion dollars or so but then they could also say well China's got gold Russia's got gold all the big trading partners have got gold what if we now actually allow gold to flow in and out of vaults and actually start to circulate and settle these differences so in a way the debt can be we can all understand that yes things from here on will be settled with with gold and that
(54:21) could be that kind of base level actual base level settlement and in a way we can then work through cuz in theory oh man am I cutting out again I'll just rip here while we're waiting for James to come back yeah I think I would not discount the potential and don't call me a Trump apologist okay don't call me Trump just just thinking through this we've been talking about this for eight years now on this podcast yeah money's broken we've been talking about the big print the sovereign debt crisis the unsustainability of the edifice of the
(55:03) financial system for 8 years it seems like it could be coming to a head and the optimist to me wants to believe that there are people in positions of power Scott Bent specifically and some others surrounding him to understand the gravity of the situation like we mentioned he opined on this many times last year there's going to be this global monetary reordering and I would not be surprised I will not be surprised if we find out at some point down the line may not be this month may not be this quarter may not even be this year but we realize
(55:41) that they understood this and decided to pull the rip cord let volatility spike let the rock of the system be laid bare to the global audience and force everybody to the table to say this is obviously unsustainable we need to figure something out what gets figured out I have no idea there's a very good potential that it's not beneficial for all of us could end up some more willing [ __ ] on the other side but hopefully we can get the Bitcoin message out there while this is happening what do you do as an individual as a listener as
(56:21) somebody worried about the quality of life for your family moving forward you know what I'm going to say i think Bitcoin is an asset you want to hold but beyond that make sure you have a strong local community and I truly believe that this bitcoinization of finance is the only manageable path out only way to make things manageable over the next decade two decades it's going to take a while and it's going to be a long haul get down on yourself become a doomer say the world [ __ ] or you can look at it as an opportunity this waste this froth this
(57:01) inherently immoral system that we've been talking about for 8 years seems to be faltering maybe on the potential of complete failure which is scary you've worked hard your life your whole life you've went to school you've gotten your degree you're working in your your cubicle job slaving away in Excel and you've always had that that feeling deep inside i'm not meant to do this this isn't human this is inhumane is this the best way I could be spending my time my finite time on this planet probably not you say to yourself
(57:36) but you get back you do your VLOOKUP and you say I got to do this to get my paycheck i need to get beers with the boys this weekend the masters is on you had the potential to embrace the chaos and view it as an opportunity to get yourself and society on a path that is more virtuous that allows you to do things that are worth doing that value your time that actually benefit society in the whole like Jonkey jobs those B2B SAS jobs if you're an SDR out there calling people like "Hey you're you're an enterprise company you need to use
(58:26) this B2B SAS product to make your your team more efficient." Soulless somewhat soulless i would say a lot of this is driven by this high velocity trash economy driven by fiat debt which leads to this misallocation of capital that props up these these soulless businesses these soulless careers we get back to sound money I like to think seen it in my own life you lower your time preference as an individual enough individuals in your community hold Bitcoin collectively you lower your time preference as a small community take that up to the
(59:05) state level nation state level opportunity cost is brought back to the market and you're forced to weigh the decisions is allocating my capital towards this endeavor worth parting ways with with this Bitcoin this hard money that I've worked so hard to accumulate you begin thinking about first order effects second order effects third order effects of parting with your Bitcoin to invest in a business or some sort of endeavor that you're passionate about and you're forced to think do I think I can get more Bitcoin at the end of the
(59:40) day by releasing this capital to go do this thing and I think that'll make people think think twice if I don't get that Bitcoin back will I be happy that I did this thing if it the answer is no it's like all right I'm going to keep my Bitcoin and think about something else to do if I spend my Bitcoin on this and it doesn't work out would I be proud of myself would I be happy with myself you know what that's a that's a risk I'm willing to take so I'm going to do it because even No there's a possibility i may not
(1:00:10) get my Bitcoin back i think this is something worthwhile something that brings my life meaning gives me hope that makes me feel like I'm being productive and bringing value to society it doesn't have to be starting a business it could be working for a business hopefully the signal that's sent to the market after an individual goes to part ways with their Bitcoin to start that business others out there who maybe don't have the risk tolerance to go start a business see a business being started and say "Hey that that seems
(1:00:41) worthwhile to me that seems like a job I could go to and feel good about myself." At the end of the day I'm waxing poetic now but trying to paint a picture we're in the fog of war things are chaotic right there right now I walked out my house this morning take my boys to school my neighbor's a wealth manager at Morgan Stanley and he's got a standing desk um like right in the the front window of his house and he's got a TV on the wall and he was just like arms crossed watching CNBC i was thinking about him i was driving the boys to school and
(1:01:20) then driving into work today to talk to James i don't know if he's coming back but we'll see if James comes back but those people what are they thinking right now stress fogwar probably thinking this is the end of the world it's not the end of the world life goes on the show must go on Logan it has to you got to get up the sun's going to rise the sun's going to set your kids are going to wake you up slap you in the nuts and say "Hey daddy get up it's another day.
(1:01:53) " They're completely oblivious to that to to all this going on and I think that's what you have to to anchor to and despite all the attention all the energy myself included that we put into trying to dissect this global economic situation we find are in sort of detaches us from the reality of everyday day life the important things your children going and talking to your neighbor getting outside touching grass basking in the glory of the sun i know many of you are scared out there right now there's good reason to be i would also urge you to look it as
(1:02:36) an incredible opportunity to get things on the right path what do they say Logan it's darkest before the dawn is that the phrase it's pretty dark it's pretty dark out there freaks i would posit there could be a dawn on the other side of this darkness we're going to win it's going to be Harry hug your kids talk to your family don't go crazy don't be pointing fingers at everybody there's certainly people that are culpable for this tariffs could have pulled forward the collapse of this uh sovereign debt crisis that exists
(1:03:26) globally by a considerable amount of time but it was inevitable it was always inevitable as Parker Lewis likes to say every time he comes on the show there's too much debt and not enough dollars the system is forced to expand and hopefully um what's happening right now is the wakeup call there's been many wakeup calls my life.
(1:03:51) com bubble 2008 repo spasm 2019 COVID 2023 banking crisis now we're here at 2025 if you play that together it looks like things are accelerating the time between each of these shock waves as James described them before his shitty internet in Bedford England crapped out and he had to drop off the call shock waves are are getting more frequent more severe hopefully this is the wakeup call that forces people to reckon with the fact with the fact with the fact that the central planners do not have control they would like to present to you that
(1:04:31) they do but they really don't and I think that's a liberating wakeup call when you realize they don't have control i should not allocate control over these important aspects of my life to these central planners i need to take control myself bitcoin allows you to do it that's the beauty of it we don't need to ask them permission to bring back sound economic policy to your personal balance sheet you can do that yourself by accumulating Bitcoin i truly do believe that's why I do this podcast we're on episode what
(1:05:09) 607 believe I produced 607 episodes of this logan's Logan maybe more maybe more 608 times I've hopped behind i think this is like 6 605 605 so not not quite yet plus a bunch of RHR plus a bunch of RHR we got Bitcoin alpha now so cumulatively more than a thousand podcasts talking about this in one way or another it's because I truly believe I do this because I truly believe that Bitcoin is the signal in the sea of noise to wax poetic and throw out some more platitudes to you freaks before we wrap up here i think we can uh I think we can
(1:05:52) get through this i think Bitcoin is part of the solution but another part of that solution is the wakeup call the recognition that we cannot trust these central planners trust yourself trust your neighbors trust your family trust your community that's how we're going to get out of this everybody pointing fingers right now hey it's 72 millennium all these hedge fund guys getting over these skis on these basis trades hey it's Donald Trump Howard Lutnik Peter Navaro with their their crazy tariff policy look it's
(1:06:27) China they're selling our our US treasuries all that may be true parts of that may be true some may have more influence on the outcome than the others that's swiping at branches slashing at branches the core of the problem lies underneath all that and until we recognize that the central planning of our monetary system based on debt is the core of the problem we're not going to fix this so hopefully the shock wave is a wakeup call anybody listening out there trust yourself find safety and sats freaks thank you for listening to
(1:07:08) the show i hope you liked it if you did like it please make sure you subscribe rate review the show it helps us out a lot and also if you like these conversations I've come to realize that many people listen to the podcast they don't know we have another sort of layer of this media company we have the newsletter the Bitcoin brief go to tftc.
(1:07:30) io make sure you subscribe there a lot of the topics that are discussed on this podcast I write about 5 days a week in the newsletter we also have the TFTC elite tier if you sign up for that become a member we have a private Discord server for the elite freaks out there where we're dropping adree versions of this show and having discussions about everything we talk about a day early logan wanted me to make sure if you want to get the show a day early become a TFTC Elite member you will get that we have our Discord server right now it's
(1:08:10) conversation between myself and TFTC elite tier members but we're going to expand that we'll probably do close Q&As with people in the industry uh I may be doing macro Mondays so join us go to tftc.io subscribe find the button in the top right corner of the website become a TFTC Elite member thank you for joining us
